John Dixon's blog
R2P Reasons to keep paying?
04:44 AM on May 25, 2007

There have been many personal blogs from people celebrating their movement to paying member, and singing the virtues of doing so. I would like to put a counter argument to that.

I have been with r2p for around 5 months and paid since day 1. R2P became my primary place to race so I had no problem paying a small amount of money for the entertainment. I made a couple of complaints about the Euro schedule at the time which I could just about make, and Tim listened. Season 5 came and the Euro schedule actually got worse for me by 15 minutes. This has meant that in May I have had 5 races. It`s still value for money I suppose but could I have done the same races for free? With the exception of the GT-I race the answer is yes.

Yesterday I canceled my automatic paypal subscription to r2p. I still have a bit of time left on my membership from my last payment. I have not yet decided whether i will continue as a paying member, but in canceling the subscription I am now in control of that decision.

Ok thats where my mindset is at. Here is the point. I dont believe that r2p incentives paying members enough. Besides the ability to compete in the GT-I the only other benefit for me is that i can schedule races a few weeks in advance. In effect that means nothing to me. The mid week Euro schedule means I often cancel those races I booked a couple of weeks ago anyway. Yeah I know there are other incentives, like the panoz thing, the wtcc loan thing, but they don't mean anything to me. I just want to race.

When r2p announced an effective end to long periods of racing for free, the backlash was such that the decision was retracted. So free members continue to race here with probably 90% of the benefit that paying members get. Wait, before you think it, I am not trying to belittle race for free drivers here, in fact I am considering joining you. However paying members should have considerably more influence than free members. They are the ones who contribute to the infrastructure that allows free members to race. Without those paying members r2p wouldn't be what it is and what it will become.

As I mentioned before the benefit of being able to join races 4 weeks ahead really doesnt help when I dont know what time I will get home from work the next day, never mind in 4 weeks time. As a paying member there are 2 benefits I would like:

The ability to join races and if necessary bump free members from races up to 1 hour before qualifying. Seems harsh? Not really, I am paying for them to race!

When I protested that Euro races were being scheduled 15 minutes earlier than season 4, Tim informed me that the survey dictated this. I wondered how many free members were able to influence that. In my opinion free members should not get a vote on schedule, in fact they shouldn't have any influence at all. As a free member you enjoy what has been setup for you, you don't have a box to complain from because you take and don't give. As a paying member your almost a customer of r2p. Those are the people that should be kept happy.

Lastly I wouldn't like this post to be seen as something less than constructive. There are many excellent things at r2p. However I am now racing more at the league I raced with before r2p for free, than I do here. Thats influenced mostly by the euro start times. This is just one man`s thoughts on membership and I might perhaps be in the minority on this, but I thought it was worth posting them. Again, I am not against free members at all. In fact when the 30 day limit was proposed I posted against it, saying that free members have a positive contribution to r2p in that they make up the numbers. BUT free members should just be doing that, making up the numbers, because at the moment thats all I am doing and paying to do so. 10 dollars is nothing, but if spending 10 dollars brings you nothing, better then in your bank than someone else's.




Posted by Enis Dauti at 05:04 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #1

Completely constructive post if you ask me. :)

Posted by Jim Fisher at 05:47 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #2

As a soon to be paying member, I would have to agree with eveything John has said.

R2P is a great place, but in all honesty it's only my concience that's urging me to pay. I don't feel I'll actually get anything extra that's really worthwhile for my money when I become a paying member.

As a non-paying member, I couldnt'd disagree with anything John has said.

Posted by Scott Michaels at 06:02 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #3

Well said John, I have to agree too.
I also get the feeling Americans get more value than Europeans... although I think that might be about to change a little...

Posted by Pete Bunce at 06:31 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #4

No arguement here either, John. Personally, I would have liked to see the Euro start times go 15 minutes the other way - it would sure make my life a hell of a lot easier!

Posted by Roberto Massa at 06:49 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #5

Being a paying member since few day I titally agree.
I don't see any big advance ATM, and I hope something will change, letting free members join but with little limitations (e.g. give priority to paying members on joining event lists).
Even when I was a free member I considered "normal" to give priority to paying members on entering racing lists.

Posted by George Pol at 08:27 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #6

Well said m8. 100% constructive imho.

Posted by John Mueller at 08:49 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #7

Well said John,I know Tim can't please everyone but maybe take a poll with the Paying Euro guys & see how many would like the starting times pushed back a bit.
I'm with Jim F. I felt guilty racing for free when Tim & Todd put so much time & effort in running this league.
Not so much being an advantage to paying.

Posted by Michael Kolar at 08:58 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #8

I bet Tim & Todd could probably generate some schedule survey results based on membership, would be interesting to compare to see if the results would have been different. I think that's a good suggestion, though there's no guarantee it would have made a difference for you.

Personally I've gotten specific value out of being a standard member because of my participation in last season's nGT series, which was often pretty much full by the time free members could sign up. So far I haven't missed not being a premium member, because the GT-I schedule doesn't work for me, and as far as I know that's the only series with skins I would have needed it for.

The other value I get is the very existence of a place like this. Even when my race schedule is a little thin, which it is right now, I come here every day to see the forums and blogs and stay in touch with my racing friends. There is a lot of work going on behind the scenes to maintain the site, run the races, pay for the servers. The fact that it's all available at all is a value that shouldn't be discounted out of hand.

Posted by Dan Ortega at 09:43 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #9

Well said Michael! : )

I don't pay just for my own satisfaction, but also to help the "T" boys make this thing grow. It feels good to know that my contribution is helping make R2P the great place to race.

Dan

Posted by John Dixon at 09:48 AM on May 25, 2007
Comment #10

The level of support here has suprised me, I expected to take a bit of a blasting.

The reason I paid and seemingly like others who pay, is because they want to support r2p and not because they actually feel any benefit from it. If r2p is working for you then you will have no problem. However for me it isnt, and i wonder if one of the reasons it isnt is because free members can influence in that way.


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